Three Litre
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Post by Three Litre on May 8, 2020 9:04:33 GMT
A big pity that the current crisis has scuppered the celebrations and that it also threatens those very people, few in number, who are now in care homes.
I was thinking that after the war was over, what happened next was a big disappointment to the people of Europe. What happened next was that the Russians thought they had a god given right to occupy and control the eastern European countries. Ironically, Poland who we went to war because they got invaded and who got treated very badly near the war's end by the Germans, then had to endure 40 years of communist rule. We destroyed one dictatorship to end up with another, more successful one that caused untold hardship and expense.
I don't mean Thatcher by the way. The Soviets were a horrible bunch, they supported the North Koreans in their bid to dominate that peninsula and caused thousands of deaths only 5 years later, plus umpteen other conflicts.
After WW2 I imagine most people thought that was it for major wars but it hasn't been the case. The formation of the UN did really achieve what people hoped for either.
The west is far from perfect and have caused unnecessary conflict as well, 2003 Iraq war for one and interfered in other countries politics after the war, Iran in the 50's and Cuba in the 60's.
But at least we try to follow decent democratic rules.
Not sure what we have got is what the millions who laid down their lives wanted.
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Cartman
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Post by Cartman on May 8, 2020 13:48:24 GMT
I think we had a window of about 25 years after the war when the country wasn’t bad, from about the early 50s, when rationing ended until it went bad in the 80s when factories shut and unemployment trebled. On VE Day itself Dad was on his way back from a POW camp in what is now the Czech Republic where he had spent the last three years of the war
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DI Alex Drake
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Post by DI Alex Drake on May 8, 2020 14:04:54 GMT
My mum's dad was shot down in his first flight as a rear gunner and (luckily) was picked up by a German boat but then spent the rest of the war as a POW in Germany. He did, however, become fluent in German which meant that he got work translating for the patent office when he returned to England. My dad's dad went all over the place in the army - I know he was in Italy, Iceland and somewhere else that was hot, but pretty much managed to avoid the enemy everywhere they went! The boy whowould have been my dad's uncle was killed aboard the HMS Gloucester off Crete at the age of 18 in 1940 . All very crazy, really, isn't it.
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Cartman
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Post by Cartman on May 8, 2020 14:27:16 GMT
Yes, the result of the three years in the camp gave dad a working knowledge of German. When the paper mill he worked in were ordering a new machine from Germany in the early 70s, he got the job of going to Hamburg to check it out.
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Three Litre
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VE Day
May 8, 2020 16:27:46 GMT
Post by Three Litre on May 8, 2020 16:27:46 GMT
My mum's dad was shot down in his first flight as a rear gunner and (luckily) was picked up by a German boat but then spent the rest of the war as a POW in Germany. He did, however, become fluent in German which meant that he got work translating for the patent office when he returned to England. My dad's dad went all over the place in the army - I know he was in Italy, Iceland and somewhere else that was hot, but pretty much managed to avoid the enemy everywhere they went! The boy whowould have been my dad's uncle was killed aboard the HMS Gloucester off Crete at the age of 18 in 1940 . All very crazy, really, isn't it. Iceland, what on earth was he doing there! Don't say getting the weekend shopping!
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Three Litre
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VE Day
May 8, 2020 16:35:06 GMT
Post by Three Litre on May 8, 2020 16:35:06 GMT
My dad was just too young to getting involved in the fighting, good job as his regiment were on the beaches at Normandy so who knows what might have happened.
He stayed in for a couple of years and was made an officer, he ran a prison camp in Palestine when the Jews started to return there and for a while were considered terrorists (or some of them) as they were killing people, including Brits. What a mess. Still is.
My dad's dad was in the first war at the Somme.
Well, he was in nearby village and went over to complain about the noise. (in the style of Ronnie Corbett).
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DI Alex Drake
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VE Day
May 8, 2020 17:24:09 GMT
Post by DI Alex Drake on May 8, 2020 17:24:09 GMT
My mum's dad was shot down in his first flight as a rear gunner and (luckily) was picked up by a German boat but then spent the rest of the war as a POW in Germany. He did, however, become fluent in German which meant that he got work translating for the patent office when he returned to England. My dad's dad went all over the place in the army - I know he was in Italy, Iceland and somewhere else that was hot, but pretty much managed to avoid the enemy everywhere they went! The boy who would have been my dad's uncle was killed aboard the HMS Gloucester off Crete at the age of 18 in 1940 . All very crazy, really, isn't it. Iceland, what on earth was he doing there! Don't say getting the weekend shopping! God knows! I just know that their kit for Iceland is what they had when they ended up in whatever the hot place was ... which meant they were rather over dressed!
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DI Alex Drake
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VE Day
May 8, 2020 17:27:21 GMT
Post by DI Alex Drake on May 8, 2020 17:27:21 GMT
My dad was just too young to getting involved in the fighting, good job as his regiment were on the beaches at Normandy so who knows what might have happened. He stayed in for a couple of years and was made an officer, he ran a prison camp in Palestine when the Jews started to return there and for a while were considered terrorists (or some of them) as they were killing people, including Brits. What a mess. Still is. That is lucky, not a nice place to find yourself. Really? How awful. My generation honestly don't seem to have had a lot of history taught to us. I mean granted, I did Geography because it was my favourite and for my school that meant bye bye history, but there seems to be so much, even in the last hundred years, that I've never been taught about whatsoever. We did the Romans and the Ancient Greeks and Egyptians but nothing ... you know ... relevant. I enjoyed ancient history, don't get me wrong, but it's embarrassing what we don't know.
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Cartman
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Post by Cartman on May 8, 2020 19:33:55 GMT
There is an argument that Britain is partially to blame for the situation in the middle East. During the first world war, the whole area was part of the Ottoman Empire, controlled by Turkey, who were on the German side. The idea was to try and knock Turkey out of the war by encouraging an Arab revolt, and promises were made to both the Arabs and the Jews, about giving them independence. After the war, the middle East was simply allocated to Britain,and France, as mandated territories.
After the second world war, Britain interfered in Iran over oil. Britain controlled the Anglo Iranian oil company which we had developed in the 1920s, by the 50s, Iran decided that,as it was their only real asset, they wanted the revenue so nationalised it, pointing out that Britain had had 30 years worth of cheap oil. With the aid of the Americans, the Iranian government was deposed and the Shah reinstated, which most Iranians didn't want. This led to resentment which resulted, ultimately,in the revolution in 79, and the Ayatollah, and the growth of Islamic fundamentalism.
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