Television Studio Discussion

[Sparky]

Managed to find a version of the software and run it up in a BBC Micro Emulator.....

Pretty easy really - even I can do it. Obviously, I will never be a journalist.

[Nightfly]

I can't believe during the few months that I've been here that I've managed to miss this thread ! Great reading - thanks to Sparky and all those who contributed. There are some dedicated sites devoted to TV studios from years gone by but this topic seems to cover far more than all of them put together.

Being a bit of a continuity announcer wannabe (though I'm 20 years too late), I've always been fascinated by TV presentation. I found this clip of the LWT transmission controller and the lovely Trish Bertram back in 1993 delivering a flawless announcement whilst another network controller barks some info into her headphones unexpectedly.

I've just started reading Peter Dickson's (voice of X Factor) autobiography and he covers his early years as an announcer at the BBC in Belfast. He claims the BBC Northern Ireland globe was adapted from a ping pong ball mounted on an old Dansette record player. He also claims he added an extra island to the globe with felt pen one night and no-one noticed for years... though I'm not sure how much of the story is embellished for the book.

Click the Watch On YouTube link on the screen below.

[Sparky]

Nov 18, 2021 11:40:49 GMT Nightfly said:

I can't believe during the few months that I've been here that I've managed to miss this thread ! Great reading - thanks to Sparky and all those who contributed. There are some dedicated sites devoted to TV studios from years gone by but this topic seems to cover far more than all of them put together.

Being a bit of a continuity announcer wannabe (though I'm 20 years too late), I've always been fascinated by TV presentation. I found this clip of the LWT transmission controller and the lovely Trish Bertram back in 1993 delivering a flawless announcement whilst another network controller barks some info into her headphones unexpectedly.

I've just started reading Peter Dickson's (voice of X Factor) autobiography and he covers his early years as an announcer at the BBC in Belfast. He claims the BBC Northern Ireland globe was adapted from a ping pong ball mounted on an old Dansette record player. He also claims he added an extra island to the globe with felt pen one night and no-one noticed for years... though I'm not sure how much of the story is embellished for the book.

This thread isn't easy to find - it's buried away!

Gene, Sam and the squad have kindly allowed me to post bits and pieces within a restricted area - to prevent them popping up all over the internet elsewhere "like a bloody crocus"....

Talking of LWT, on their last day of the LWT brand - I think around 2002 - as it was all re-branded "ITV1" - or "ITV Gone" - they did their final weekend using the old LWT graphics - including a morning startup.

They couldn't reuse archive material as some of it was non existent, those bits that lurked on tapes were in poor condition and would look even worse if they were modified to suit the 16:9 format.

A mate of mine, a Graphic Designer was commissioned to re-do all of their graphics - in 16:9. Which he painstakingly did, frame by frame.

While working on them, he sent me some grabs of his work in progress. I'll ask if he minds me posting a couple on here.

On the subject of Presentation - while working on the ITV50 stuff years back; we interviewed a Continuity Announcer who worked for ATV and Central around 1979-1983.

Back then, announcements were in vision and she explained, all the presentation studio contained was a fixed camera and a floor manager.

She had a Transmission monitor and a preview monitor with the incoming programme.

While having to talk to the viewers, she had to watch the clock on the incoming monitor, while watch the floor manager, while have someone in her ear barking orders.

If they lost the programme feed, or film broke - she'd have to just sit and improvise live....

[Del Boy]

Fantastic stuff Sparky. Hopefully we can get a look at some of that stuff.  Thanks in advance 

[Cartman]

When did Ceefax/Teletext start? I remember going to someone's house in late 79, and they'd just got a new telly with the text, and I hadn't seen it before

[Nightfly]

Nov 18, 2021 12:16:56 GMT Sparky said:

Back then, announcements were in vision and she explained, all the presentation studio contained was a fixed camera and a floor manager.

Although in-vision continuity is missed by many, I always preferred the mystique of the out of vision announcers. It was usually a shock to find, particularly at YTV, that the dark deep voices of the veteran announcers like Redvers Kyle were often skinny blokes just over 5ft who's faces never actually fitted their voices.  However, I do miss quite miss the local in-vision announcers on regional BBC with their self op vision/sound mixers, watching their hands just out of shot fumbling for the button to cut to the local BBC globe or weather caption with the inevitable clunking sound as they cut between the various sources.

There was an announcer on Border TV in the early 80s called John Myers, who would later become a big name in radio group management. He apparently got a b**cking for closing down Border one night with.. That's all from us tonight at Border. Join us tomorrow and sleep well... (30 seconds silence)... BOOOO!!

[Sparky]

Nov 18, 2021 12:59:11 GMT Cartman said:

When did Ceefax/Teletext start? I remember going to someone's house in late 79, and they'd just got a new telly with the text, and I hadn't seen it before

I think it's neck and neck - BBC started their teletext service in 1974, I don't think Oracle was far behind. As they were both jointly developed.

CEEFAX (or pages from) began to appear during the day sometime in the early 80s - replacing long periods between the programmes usually covered by the Test-Card.

I seem to think this was around 1980/1, as the BBC revemped it's daily schedules, had a new 'globe' and presentation material, as well as Watch with Mother was dropped to be replaced by Seesaw.

Annoyingly, for those who fixed TVs (not me), less and less Test-Card broadcasts didn't help and they had to invest in expensive generators.

Not sure about the BBC, though ITV had their own Teletext service - which was routed throughout the ITV countries and could be viewed on TV screens in canteens at the various studios.

In the late 80s, Central had their own - shared between Birmingham, Nottingham, Oxford studios and the smaller outpost offices used for News. This was call "CenText"...

Jobfinder (often broadcast overnight during early 24hour ITV days) was originally a Teletext style setup.

Although in-vision continuity is missed by many, I always preferred the mystique of the out of vision announcers. It was usually a shock to find, particularly at YTV, that the dark deep voices of the veteran announcers like Redvers Kyle were often skinny blokes just over 5ft who's faces never actually fitted their voices. However, I do miss quite miss the local in-vision announcers on regional BBC with their self op vision/sound mixers, watching their hands just out of shot fumbling for the button to cut to the local BBC globe or weather caption with the inevitable clunking sound as they cut between the various sources.

YTV (I gather) only used in-vision for a very brief period when then came on air in 1968; and then they used voice overs from there on.

About 10 years ago I was working at YTV studios and "accidentally" got lost while finding my way from the canteen.

By this time, not a lot was left in there production wise - as Countdown had moved to Manchester, Local News was across the Road, Emmerdale interiors were also across the road in a wherehouse.

The In-Announcers presentation studio was still there, pretty much as it would have been in 1968, even with dreadful orange "1970s Woolworths Cafe style" curtains & drapes, though a new camera, and a pop up blue screen had been set up as it was used to pre-record late night local weather inserts.

A new presentation control room had been built on the ground floor, at the side of the main reception - with a huge glass window so you could peer in while waiting.

This area was (then) named "The Northern Transmission Centre" - responsible for all of ITVs output for the North of the country (apart from Scotland and N Ireland)

This was when regional stations were scaling down.

So as an example, the local news from the Midlands, shot in the midlands would be routed to Leeds, and then back to the Midlands transmitters, and the same went for the other ITV stations...

I think now - all of ITVs playout is centralised from London.

[Nightfly]

Nov 18, 2021 14:26:17 GMT Sparky said:

Nov 18, 2021 12:59:11 GMT Cartman said:

A new presentation control room had been built on the ground floor, at the side of the main reception - with a huge glass window so you could peer in while waiting.

This area was (then) named "The Northern Transmission Centre" - responsible for all of ITVs output for the North of the country (apart from Scotland and N Ireland)

This was when regional stations were scaling down.

So as an example, the local news from the Midlands, shot in the midlands would be routed to Leeds, and then back to the Midlands transmitters, and the same went for the other ITV stations...

I think now - all of ITVs playout is centralised from London.

I remember hearing that during the last few years of local announcers, the Yorkshire announcer would do links for Tyne Tees and Granada too. The Yorkshire one would be live and the other two recorded just minutes before.

Not sure how true this is, but I heard that a great deal of playout for the likes of Gold, Dave and other channels is all computerised and just watched over by non-techies who aren't overly paid, which probably explains why a repeat of part one of a show is played out after the first break and sometimes goes unnoticed and sound levels can sometimes be all over the place.

On the subject of Ceefax and Oracle, I think the GPO had a rival service called Prestel which from memory was a kind of interactive teletext which hooked up to the TV and phone line - a kind of forerunner to the Internet I suppose. I don't think it lasted too long.

[Sparky]

Nov 18, 2021 21:34:11 GMT Nightfly said:

Nov 18, 2021 14:26:17 GMT Sparky said:

A new presentation control room had been built on the ground floor, at the side of the main reception - with a huge glass window so you could peer in while waiting.

This area was (then) named "The Northern Transmission Centre" - responsible for all of ITVs output for the North of the country (apart from Scotland and N Ireland)

This was when regional stations were scaling down.

So as an example, the local news from the Midlands, shot in the midlands would be routed to Leeds, and then back to the Midlands transmitters, and the same went for the other ITV stations...

I think now - all of ITVs playout is centralised from London.

I remember hearing that during the last few years of local announcers, the Yorkshire announcer would do links for Tyne Tees and Granada too. The Yorkshire one would be live and the other two recorded just minutes before.

Not sure how true this is, but I heard that a great deal of playout for the likes of Gold, Dave and other channels is all computerised and just watched over by non-techies who aren't overly paid, which probably explains why a repeat of part one of a show is played out after the first break and sometimes goes unnoticed and sound levels can sometimes be all over the place.

On the subject of Ceefax and Oracle, I think the GPO had a rival service called Prestel which from memory was a kind of interactive teletext which hooked up to the TV and phone line - a kind of forerunner to the Internet I suppose. I don't think it lasted too long.

Yorkshire / Tyne Tees were the first to merge up - or "share resources" as it was put to staff and the public.

It was only a matter of time before someone with a calculator started number crunching and finding ways to reduce costs and maximize profits.

Yorkshire / Tyne Tees / Anglia tried to merge together in the 1970s - and set up one holding group called Trident Television.

Not seen many Anglia or Tyne-Tees programmes with the Trident branding on, but there are quite a few episodes of "Rising Damp" and "Only When I laugh" where the Trident name is included on the end YTV logo.

The IBA jumped in and stopped this merger as they claimed it would "affect the quality of the each of the companies output".

Carlton pitched for the ATV and Thames franchises in 1980 - and were kicked out by the IBA as it was felt that they (Carlton) didn't have enough experience or a decent plan for balanced programming.

I wasn't a big fan of the IBA - I found some of their ideas trapped in the 1930s - but in some respects, they were years ahead of everyone and in retrospect, they kept ITV in line.

The Granada / Carlton merger is a tale on it's own - headed by Charles Allen.

Between them - Granada and Carlton each merged the larger companies into their own (by doing shareholder buyouts, so they could get a majority) and then they both, each took over the smaller companies and merged them in.

Before long you had two large companies controlling about 97% of ITV - then all they needed to do (and did) was go cap in hand to the Monopolies commission - to get permission to merge the two companies together - which became the ITV as we know it.

That's it in a nutshell - I left out all the crap about closing studios, auctioning off / scrapping equipment, the 1000s of joblosses and the axing of expensive productions.

STV, Ulster and Channel TV stuck two fingers up and told them to F.O and kept themselves to themselves.

For a majority of the Freeview Channels - Challenge / Dave / Gold etc, the announcements are pre-recorded and automatically played over when needed.

On Challenge, the announcements were all recorded by Sarah Cawood.

The ones on "Dave" were recorded by Ralph someone or other.

I think both the BBC and ITV1 still do theirs live to some extent.

Though - ITV did go through a phase of having the announcer pre-record a few minutes before the announcement was needed.

[Nightfly]

Nov 19, 2021 7:35:17 GMT Sparky said:

Nov 18, 2021 21:34:11 GMT Nightfly said:

STV, Ulster and Channel TV stuck two fingers up and told them to F.O and kept themselves to themselves.

For a majority of the Freeview Channels - Challenge / Dave / Gold etc, the announcements are pre-recorded and automatically played over when needed.

On Challenge, the announcements were all recorded by Sarah Cawood.

The ones on "Dave" were recorded by Ralph someone or other.

It's a shame that the others didn't do the same as STV, Ulster and Channel. Good luck to them on keeping the presentation local and relevant to the audience. Most of the ITV2 announcements not only seem pre-recorded but often there's no attempt to have any variation. The same Ahh the memories as we step back in time for some Classic Corrie often twice in one hour.

Yes, it's Ralph Ineson on Dave, better known as Chris Finch the dodgy sales rep from The Office.

I found this the other day which might be of interest. A couple of retired BBC VT engineers go exploring Television Centre just as it's about to be sold off and redeveloped as luxury flats in 2013:-


Incidentally, if anyone fancies an apartment in TVC they're available for anyone with £2.75 million to spare. I think I'll have another delve into the sofa for some spare change.