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Post by Arthur Pringle on Aug 17, 2021 20:51:23 GMT
I think it boils down to the fact that anyone with an internet connection has a voice, complaining ( for want of a better word ) has become very easy. Pre internet you might write a letter to a newspaper or complain to your MP, now all you need do is leave a comment or tweet.
It's all driven by the media, they latch onto something in their usual s**t stirring way & before you know it it's become a 'thing', like 'cancel culture'. Then everyone else is compelled to follow certain guidelines re what you can & can't say or broadcast.
People genuinely concerned about the state of the World don't complain about old tv shows & inappropriate tweets by public figures, these things are an irrelevance compared to real World matters.
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Cartman
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Post by Cartman on Aug 17, 2021 21:10:24 GMT
Excellent point Arthur. The internet has, unfortunately, given a voice to people we would be better off not hearing from. As you say, at one time their only option was angry letters to The Guardian/Scum/Heil/Express and 99% of them couldn't be bothered, but now it's much easier.
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Sparky
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Post by Sparky on Aug 19, 2021 8:17:36 GMT
Culture wars and this "cancel culture" which has crept in fairly recently. It will actually be the end of culture if it is allowed to go unchecked. I can maybe see the sense in new n material, if the publisher thinks there is some content which might not fit current sensibilities, but applying it retrospectively to tv/films/music etc from earlier years I think is wrong. It's reminiscent of what you get in authoritarian regimes, imagine you are a publisher there and you can only out out stuff the government allows, you get a submission.. "What's the theme of this work?" A lot of TV scriptwriters have been putting up with stuff like this for (at least) the last 10 years. Especially with the BBC. ITV and Channel 4 have slowly followed suit.
Every so often the BBC will put out a 'script call', where writers can send in "unspecified scripts" (scripts that have been written off the cuff without any commission) - so, naturally - the BBC will end up with piles of scripts varying in Story and Quality. In my eyes - great scope for a series like Play For Today.
Every script goes through the same process of assessment by "Script Editors" - most writers end up with notes telling them to "remove this" as it isn't appropriate, or even "add this" or "include a storyline" about whatever they are trying to push.
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Nightfly
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Post by Nightfly on Aug 19, 2021 10:52:52 GMT
Every so often the BBC will put out a 'script call', where writers can send in "unspecified scripts" (scripts that have been written off the cuff without any commission) - so, naturally - the BBC will end up with piles of scripts varying in Story and Quality. In my eyes - great scope for a series like Play For Today. Every script goes through the same process of assessment by "Script Editors" - most writers end up with notes telling them to "remove this" as it isn't appropriate, or even "add this" or "include a storyline" about whatever they are trying to push. Interesting to hear this, Sparky . In my late teens I had a go at writing and fired off tentative drama scripts regularly for about 18 months, mainly to the Beeb, some TV, some radio. Of course I didn't get anywhere because I was crap . But back then, they were solely interested in your script/story. They didn't want to know about your background as the idea was if your "voice" was effective, it will come out in your story/dialogue. In fact you weren't even supposed to include character notes as the details of your characters should all be there in your words on the page. Although you were in competition with many other hopefuls, you could submit at any time and you'd just have the same opportunity as any other bod who was in the same boat as you. Out of curiosity recently, I had a look at how the BBC get new writers. These days it seems to be through something they call "The Writer's Room". New writers can only submit through this part of the Beeb and there are only one or two opportunities per year when they will read submissions. You're supposed to write a "calling card" script which will not get produced but will show your skills. The select few can then be invited in with a view to "developing you as a writer". With your submission you have to include a biography and there are extra opportunities for writers from backgrounds that are under represented. The process seems to have radically changed over the last 20 years. I still think editors should look solely at the script on its own merits. Think of the diverse selection of writers on The Sweeney. University graduates and established writers together with guys from the East End from poor backgrounds. In the end, the viewer wants a good story and doesn't care who has written it, as they will be able to tell whether it has an authentic voice or not. Also, I believe The Sweeney got by without having a script editor.
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Sparky
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Post by Sparky on Aug 19, 2021 12:52:48 GMT
Every so often the BBC will put out a 'script call', where writers can send in "unspecified scripts" (scripts that have been written off the cuff without any commission) - so, naturally - the BBC will end up with piles of scripts varying in Story and Quality. In my eyes - great scope for a series like Play For Today. Every script goes through the same process of assessment by "Script Editors" - most writers end up with notes telling them to "remove this" as it isn't appropriate, or even "add this" or "include a storyline" about whatever they are trying to push. Interesting to hear this, Sparky . In my late teens I had a go at writing and fired off tentative drama scripts regularly for about 18 months, mainly to the Beeb, some TV, some radio. Of course I didn't get anywhere because I was crap . But back then, they were solely interested in your script/story. They didn't want to know about your background as the idea was if your "voice" was effective, it will come out in your story/dialogue. In fact you weren't even supposed to include character notes as the details of your characters should all be there in your words on the page. Although you were in competition with many other hopefuls, you could submit at any time and you'd just have the same opportunity as any other bod who was in the same boat as you. Out of curiosity recently, I had a look at how the BBC get new writers. These days it seems to be through something they call "The Writer's Room". New writers can only submit through this part of the Beeb and there are only one or two opportunities per year when they will read submissions. You're supposed to write a "calling card" script which will not get produced but will show your skills. The select few can then be invited in with a view to "developing you as a writer". With your submission you have to include a biography and there are extra opportunities for writers from backgrounds that are under represented. The process seems to have radically changed over the last 20 years. I still think editors should look solely at the script on its own merits. Think of the diverse selection of writers on The Sweeney. University graduates and established writers together with guys from the East End from poor backgrounds. In the end, the viewer wants a good story and doesn't care who has written it, as they will be able to tell whether it has an authentic voice or not. Also, I believe The Sweeney got by without having a script editor. Most writers have to have a "Spec Script" or "Calling Card" - Quentin Tarantinos was "True Lies" - which became a movie on it's own- though not Directed by him in the end.
A lot of writers I know don't even bother with a spec script - they write a short film and (somehow) raise the cash, go away and make it reasonably cheaply. There are tons of amazing short films out there, a lot in production currently too.
Normally, if you approach someone with an off the cuff idea, you'd write a Format/Treatment - which is about 2-3 pages outlining your idea, characters and possible stories. If written well enough, that should be enough for a producer to say "Yes - write me a script" or go "No - sorry".
The "Minder" and "Sweeney" formats are published in the book "Made for TV - Euston Films" (not 100% on the title!)
The BBC writers room is a good place to start; you can get a good grounding for getting a suitable script or idea together before submitting it. Though they tend to teach you how to write, how the BBC wants you to write.
The issue's I (and many Directors and Writers) have, is the process beyond this - where Producers & Focus groups sit around and virtually rip your idea to bits (having OKd it) and want to add this & that - because it's the current agenda. Many younger writers will accept this as the norm, older writers will fight their corner.
Part of the acceptance "deal" will include a clause that the Producers have to write to adjust/alter scenes and storylines. That's where a good literary agent comes in and argues the toss.
I can't think of any series or drama where there isn't a Script Editor these days; a lot of them seem more a hindrance than any real use - and in a couple of experiences - have stuck their snouts in at the 11th hour, on a whim and held production for 1/2 a day - while they argue a point within a scene.
And I thought the script was pretty much nailed to the best before it went into production!
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Post by Arthur Pringle on Aug 19, 2021 18:40:59 GMT
I keep seeing this tv ad starring Duggie Brown, for some reason it gets on my bristols, could he not have at least combined taking a single plastic bag to the Co-Op recycling point with some shopping?
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Nightfly
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Post by Nightfly on Aug 20, 2021 12:32:16 GMT
I keep seeing this tv ad starring Duggie Brown, for some reason it gets on my bristols, could he not have at least combined taking a single plastic bag to the Co-Op recycling point with some shopping? Wouldn't have spotted it was Duggie until reading this, Arthur. As for not doing his shopping at the same time, maybe he had to rush back as he was expecting the plumber to come and mend his pipes (and anyone who understands that reference will be showing their age ).
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Post by Arthur Pringle on Aug 20, 2021 19:35:16 GMT
I didn't realise it was Duggie Brown until I read it in the youtube comments. Though he's been in other things since the last time I can remember seeing him in was an episode of 'Common As Muck', 1997 according to imdb!
I had to google the pipe reference! He makes a Jimmy Savile noise at the start of the clip, must be a Yorkshire thing-
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Cartman
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Post by Cartman on Sept 24, 2021 14:26:50 GMT
The media again and this petrol shortage. From time to time the garages will lock off one or two of the pumps when their supply gets low, and this is normal. Hiwever, it's been latched on to by them with pictures of queues at a few stations and in no time at all its a crisis, and now people are panic buying. I got behind this bloke in a Merc at our Tesco station before ( I was on the red btw) who put £100 quids worth in.
Have the panic buyers eaten all the bog roll they stocked up on yet?
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Sparky
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Post by Sparky on Sept 24, 2021 14:54:25 GMT
The media again and this petrol shortage. From time to time the garages will lock off one or two of the pumps when their supply gets low, and this is normal. Hiwever, it's been latched on to by them with pictures of queues at a few stations and in no time at all its a crisis, and now people are panic buying. I got behind this bloke in a Merc at our Tesco station before ( I was on the red btw) who put £100 quids worth in. Have the panic buyers eaten all the bog roll they stocked up on yet? As I understood it, it was only BP who had issues with deliveries - not other suppliers/distributors.
While in the shop this morning, I couldn't help but notice headlines on the "Sun" and "Daily Mail" - 'Running on Empty'. Great.
So naturally, all the idiots (sheep?) are now forming long ques at local filling stations.
Must have eaten all that pasta and wiped their backsides on all the bog roll they stocked up on last year. (Stupidly). 20 years ago - a "fuel crisis" happened - wasn't this caused by Hedge Fund owners strangling the supply, to push up demand and prices?
So - we have the "threat" of power shortages through Christmas, as a well as a fuel shortage - will it be 3 day week next then?
Just like the back end of 1973.....
Over you you Gene & Sam!
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