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Post by Dirty Epic on Mar 6, 2019 9:56:35 GMT
One thing I've wondered about is did some ordinary people rather than established extra's/actors get used for some of the one off bit-part roles in Auf Pet?
The most obvious one is the barman at 'The Bell and Dragon' (The Star Inn) who shouts Dennis for Barry's phone call who I'm sure isn't an actor but the barman/landlord of the pub in Return of the Seven Part 1. His Notts accent is the glaring giveaway for me. In Part 2 the hotel receptionist scene with Wayne after Linda and Pippa have blown him out doesn't seem like it's being done by an actor either so I'm just thinking did the production crew sound some non-actors out on location before filming.
A few of the German/Elstree scenes in Series 1 and a few other characters like the shopkeeper in the village shop in Series 2 seem that way too and it would certainly be cheaper than getting extra's in to do these roles.
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Post by Sparky on Mar 6, 2019 10:21:16 GMT
The answer to that is, possibly - Yes - but used in moderation. They would certainly not be allowed to speak.
Though - (Unions again) - it would need to have been agreed with Equity the actors Union; so if members of the public were used, the numbers of those used would have to be kept to a minimum (for instance, people in offices/factories just filling in the background). The way Equity sees it, is that it's putting their members out of work if productions used members of the public.
I worked on a David Walliams christmas thing a few years back, in one scene - they needed about 30 people stood in the street in pyjamas and dressing gowns. And that's all they needed to do. Easily, they could have used residents of the street - but instead they had to draft in 30 extras.
I think (don't quote me), it;s OK for members of the public to be used in moderation, providing they aren't asked to speak, act, wear costume or even be paid - as that would constitute the role of an Actor or Extra.
Not very well up on Equity Rules I'm afraid.
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Post by Gene Hunt on Mar 6, 2019 10:28:50 GMT
The answer to that is, possibly - Yes - but used in moderation. They would certainly not be allowed to speak.
Though - (Unions again) - it would need to have been agreed with Equity the actors Union; so if members of the public were used, the numbers of those used would have to be kept to a minimum (for instance, people in offices/factories just filling in the background). The way Equity sees it, is that it's putting their members out of work if productions used members of the public.
I worked on a David Walliams christmas thing a few years back, in one scene - they needed about 30 people stood in the street in pyjamas and dressing gowns. And that's all they needed to do. Easily, they could have used residents of the street - but instead they had to draft in 30 extras.
I think (don't quote me), it;s OK for members of the public to be used in moderation, providing they aren't asked to speak, act, wear costume or even be paid - as that would constitute the role of an Actor or Extra.
Not very well up on Equity Rules I'm afraid.
Yet a few years previously, as I told in my Spring & Port Wine thread, my friend Bernie was a taxi driver, not an actor but was offered a speaking role by way of thanks for assisting with location scouting and ferrying the cast around during the shoot. He didnt get many lines but did converse briefly in his scene with Keith Buckley. Gene.
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Post by Sparky on Mar 6, 2019 10:44:25 GMT
He was lucky to get a speaking role! Good of the Director and Producer to do that!
Mind you, as you say - it was a way of thanks for scouting locations.
Though in most situations I have come across, the majority of extras had to come from an extras casting agency. In a couple of recent cases I had heard about - where members of the public had been used, they had been "given an Equity card, for a day"- though can't really comment on how that would work.
Also - I think, these days - it's more how well the Producer and Casting Director know the local Equity rep.
In many "Sweeney" episodes, there would be an extra as a "supporting police officer" - Regan would speak or give them an instruction - and they would just look at him, walk away or just nod their head. They would be told not to speak, as they would need to be paid extra!!
To give a proper answer, we'd need an Equity Member! But, years back - they were quite a bit stricter.
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Post by Dirty Epic on Mar 6, 2019 11:11:24 GMT
Ah forgot about the Equity thing here suppose as you say Sparky if they did use a few normal people in these roles a card got 'arranged' for them. Might be daft asking this but do Extra's need an Equity card to appear on screen?
I think Willy Russell was keen for normal people to get used in some of his plays when they got dramatized for TV etc. Our Day Out which I got on DVD recently certainly used a fair few normal kids from Liverpool school's for the roles. He wanted to do something similar with One Summer which was made a few years later and took a bit of humbridge when he got overruled and the roles went to established young actors who at 19 pushing 20 were significantly older than the 16 year old characters they portrayed. IIRC he wanted his writing credit removed from the show when it aired in 1982 originally because of this?
Probably Auf Pet did use jobber actors like our Aitch for the bit part roles... now if he appeared in an episode.
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Post by Sparky on Mar 6, 2019 12:05:44 GMT
Ah forgot about the Equity thing here suppose as you say Sparky if they did use a few normal people in these roles a card got 'arranged' for them. Might be daft asking this but do Extra's need an Equity card to appear on screen?
I think Willy Russell was keen for normal people to get used in some of his plays when they got dramatized for TV etc. Our Day Out which I got on DVD recently certainly used a fair few normal kids from Liverpool school's for the roles. He wanted to do something similar with One Summer which was made a few years later and took a bit of humbridge when he got overruled and the roles went to established young actors who at 19 pushing 20 were significantly older than the 16 year old characters they portrayed. IIRC he wanted his writing credit removed from the show when it aired in 1982 originally because of this?
Probably Auf Pet did use jobber actors like our Aitch for the bit part roles... now if he appeared in an episode. Not sure on how the "Equity" card thing works. I heard that you had to have a card to accept paid work.
I like the idea of using "real faces" - it adds authenticity. Though, with members of the public, you run the risk of using people inexperienced in film making - who don't understand how long a simple 15sec scene can take to shoot, or understand how controlled the enviroment is.
The David Walliams thing I worked on in 2005; most of it was shot in a Secondary School during a very wet October half-term holiday. For extras (kids and teachers to populate class rooms/dining hall/playground etc) they used children from the school, and the schools drama group. The children who had the main speaking parts in the show were auditioned - I think, via various stage schools. Casting Directors often have good contacts with Stage Schools/Agents and will put out a Casting Call to prospective agents.
Central Television was proud to have the "CTV Workshop" - or Childrens Television Workshop, which was a drama group based at the Nottingham Studios from 1984 until Carlton scrapped it in 2001. Kids from that auditioned and appeared in "Auf Pet", "Murphys Mob", "Woof", "Good Health" etc - but had to audition.
When using kids, there are strict rules on their working hours too. Most - where they have children, will have an onset tutor, and a trailer with a classroom in - so between shots, the Set Tutor can ensure their school work is completed.
In the "Sweeney" - 'Supersnout' - the Stripper in the club with Regan and Stickley was a real stripper (aparently). Possibly seen and auditioned in the Red Cow one lunchtime.....
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Post by Sparky on Mar 6, 2019 12:12:33 GMT
Probably Auf Pet did use jobber actors like our Aitch for the bit part roles... now if he appeared in an episode. Aitch would more than likely be able to give us the full SP on Equity and the rules for using Members of the Public.
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Post by Dirty Epic on Mar 6, 2019 12:35:59 GMT
Yes Sparky I remember when Aitch came to one of the meets in 2010 and he mentioned he usually got called for work for various film/TV shows at short notice over the years. He didn't mention anything about Equity and I can't recall whether it was his agent or the producers/production company which contacted him for these jobs. Think he was on friendly terms with a lot of producers over the years so likely got a few informal calls for work.
Yes would've liked to have seen Aitch in Auf Pet and he was brilliant at the meet. I hope he's all good at the moment.
I do like it when normal people get in on the action in TV/films but as you say the problem is whether things like nerves and not wanting to come across as rubbish etc. gets in the way of them doing a decent performance that a Extra or jobber could do better. I know from brief experience that it's not easy to perform when a crew and a few cameras put you in the centre of a production and having to follow their lead on things etc.
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Post by Sam Tyler on Mar 6, 2019 13:27:03 GMT
Yes Sparky I remember when Aitch came to one of the meets in 2010 and he mentioned he usually got called for work for various film/TV shows at short notice over the years. He didn't mention anything about Equity and I can't recall whether it was his agent or the producers/production company which contacted him for these jobs. Think he was on friendly terms with a lot of producers over the years so likely got a few informal calls for work.
Sorry to contradict you Dirty but Aitch did mention Equity during his day with us. Basically he confirmed then what Sparky has told us now about extras being paid more for speaking roles. IIRC it was while he was talking about his role in McVicar when he and Roger Daltry clashed in the TV room and his words were unscripted. The first take was cut when Aitch apologised for bumping into "McVicar" and he was instructed to use words more suited so the second take when they bumped he told McVicar to "F*** off!". I also recall him saying that it was a chicken / egg situation with getting the Equity card: you couldn't act without an Equity card and you couldn't get an Equity card if you weren't an actor. Sam.
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Post by Sparky on Mar 6, 2019 13:54:40 GMT
Sorry to contradict you Dirty but Aitch did mention Equity during his day with us. Basically he confirmed then what Sparky has told us now about extras being paid more for speaking roles. IIRC it was while he was talking about his role in McVicar when he and Roger Daltry clashed in the TV room and his words were unscripted. The first take was cut when Aitch apologised for bumping into "McVicar" and he was instructed to use words more suited so the second take when they bumped he told McVicar to "F*** off!". I also recall him saying that it was a chicken / egg situation with getting the Equity card: you couldn't act without an Equity card and you couldn't get an Equity card if you weren't an actor. Sam. I seem to remember from my Apprentice Days in the Rep Theatre - a story about getting hold of an Equity Card was a bit chicken & egg.
It's like that in the USA with Crew members; if I went to work in the USA - I couldn't just roll up and start finding work. I would need to at first, register with the "local" Union - then I'd have to get a card to get work. But to get the card, I would have to get something like a minimum of a weeks continual paid work on a Union Job!!!! Chicken and egg!
To achieve this, you would have to find a job that would take you on, then apply for tempory card to cover you just for that particular job. The Temp Cards are only issued during busy periods, such as during the summer when extra crew are required. Most big Hollywood produced films have a "2nd Unit".
I would expect, Aitch will have built up a huge range of contacts and trust among Producers and Casting Directors - and given his experience, the work would keep coming to him - more than likely Directly, via a Manager - or via Casting Agencies who many actors send their CV and photo too.
Theatre Stage Managers are also Equity Members too. I think that stems from the days that Assistant Stage Managers also doubled as Standins or Understudies.
Garfield Morgan (Haskins) did this at the Library Theatre in Manchester.
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